Fiction VS Reality

[DarkSideSithLord]

For the moment Im just scavenging parts and trinkets for a new episode III reveal helmet project, and Im really stuck on what to do with the neckbrace.

The episode III reveal mask for the movie had only 6 splitplugs and barely anything else, while the episode V - VI neckbrace had 8 splitplugs and lots of other parts on there.

So, Imagine this, the episode IV helmet is in reality just a two piece helmet with no parts, but in "Movie world" its meant to be a four part reveal helmet with all sorts of parts and devices. The chestboxes are just some black boxes with nothing more than lights inside, but in "Movie world" again, they are meant to be parts of a mobile life support system...

So if you see where Im going with this, my question is:

The episode III reveal prop had only 6 splitplugs, and all you get to see in the movie are the 4 splitplugs at the side. The episode V - VI neckbraces were fully revealed and had lots and lots of parts on them...

And having in mind the differences between real world and movie world, did the episode III neckbrace have less parts just because there were no point in making a really neat looking neckbrace when all you see is..nothing by the side splitplugs, but does in movie world have all the same parts as the other neckbraces?

Or is this the way it is meant to be in "Movie world" being an early stage of the neckbrace with less parts?

And notice in real life, the reveal mask has a black block with wires sticking out of it, wrapped together with a piece of green tape, but in "Movie world" that aint even there.

So, tell me all your opinions - Early stage neckbrace or less parts due to no visibillity of the neckbrace in the first place?

[Gypsyboy]

Lazy prop builders for EpIII. That's my answer.

GB

[darkblade]

well in movie world, no wait real world, hold on...
In both worlds ROTS is the "first" incarnation of the man in black, whatever the split plugs did for him the technicians (movie world) thought that would be all Anikin needed. But as we know Anakin has always been a tinkerer, builder, craftsman, and may have added more splitplugs to enhance whatever they did by the time we saw them in ROTJ.
So I would think if you wanted to add(real world) to the neck brace more tidbits, would be fine, if anyone asks, just tell them it is from a few months after the scene in the movie and Anikin(now Vader) already started to modify it to his likeing.
Hows that for a solution? I say add what you like, and make it your own!

[DarkSideSithLord]

There are less stuff inside the bottom mask as well..Hmm

Its just that..It just keeps me wonder - Non movie visible neckbrace had less parts and the visible ones in ep V - VI were both identical all along, and didnt have more and more parts as the years passed by.

He could have modified that thing yeah, it just seems so much more that the prop builders didnt really give a rats anus about the parts because the audience wouldnt be able to see the darn thing after all..

Just look at the shabby foam tubes, the top one even had a damn big cut in it having a big gap about half an inch, and they still used it...seems more to me as (Meh, they cant see it anyway)

But the modification through the years part seems 50% possible too so...

Only the dudes who built it knows the mysteries of the first neckbrace

[DarkSideSithLord]

I fiddled around with those EPIII reveal mask pics in Photoline, turned the light up and saw the internal stuff in the neckbrace, and it looks like crap, literally.

Theres knife cuts everywhere, the foam looks asif its been taken from the dump, theres bolts sticking out...damn...

Seems more and more like plain old (Meh, they cant see it anyway)

But whats all your opinions?

[webchief]

Don Bies created the reveal mask from Episode III. Don (for those of you who don't know) is the droid handler from the prequels and I believe is the lead archivist for the LFL archives.

I and a few others from my Garrison met with Don for dinner while on a trip to Skywalker Ranch and we spoke briefly about the Episode III Vader helmet. He chuckled at the thought that people would scrutinize the helmet details so meticulously. Basically he made something that looked great on screen (which is the only requirement) and made it to look similar to the old, familiar prop. It had no hidden meanings or purposes and was only meant to look cool for the 10 seconds it appeared on screen.

Before anyone gets angry, I understand that your conversation is meaning to go beyond the real world prop and to assign function to the movie world pieces however you're going far beyond Don's initial design or the design of most movie prop pieces. That's fine but don't rack your brain trying to read the prop builder's minds on this because they really didn't put as much thought into this as us replicators.

[Gypsyboy]

The only "real world Star Wars" is in the story. It's what happens in the imagination. Everything else - costumes, props, sets, etc. - that's all real world made to give the illusion of Star Wars stuff. So you are correct webchief. All they (meaning the props and costumes and sets people) are concerned about is what will look good on the screen from the angles they will be viewed. As an outside of Star Wars example, think about Batman's costume. They had some that zipped up the back, some that zipped up the side, the front, whatever, and it all depended on what angle the costume was going to be viewed from. That doesn't mean Batman had 5 different suits he wore during one incedent of crime-fighting. It just means the director didn't want us to see the zipper.

GB

[DarkSideSithLord]

If I got this straight, its all about the illusion, making stuff look cool and as if its working somehow. So Don only made the stuff you saw look cool (and it did) and the stuff you didnt see...well thats up to you to see in your mind. So when you saw the neckbrace in EP V - VI, it was made to look good on screen, but it didnt really had to look good for EP III since you never got to see it. Like for an example, R2-D2's got Kenny in him, but is "a real droid" in the movies. Its not meant to be a can with a guy in it in the movies. So...Using my *.~*Imagination*~.*.... I see in my head that the episode III neckbrace looks the same as the others, only they have the "dental expander" parts replaced by the new molex pin parts used in episode III. And that Batman thing opened my mind about this matter too - 5 different zippers, but in movie world *There is no zipper*

Thanks for the help everyone, Ill try posting some pics of it when Im done

[DarkSideSithLord]

Hmm, It seems that the neckbrace is missing parts, so thats why its ripped apart inside, so that they could unbolt the two middle splitplugs. It did have 8 after all, and now I really do believe that, even though it looks cruddy now and has 6 splitplugs, maybe Don Bies did build a neckbrace that was meant to be the early stage of it, only they had to remove stuff, possibly because when filming the thing, that those big punk-rock spikes had the bottom mask placed too high up on the table when filming or whatever, atleast now I know what to build. Guess I didnt have to use my imagination afterall...

So...Itll be like this - No parts on the four end plugs, only the spikes, all the parts on the four plugs in the middle, and no part in between the plugs in the middle as on the ROTJ one, in that open hole, foamy tubes over and under the neckbrace, and all the other parts needed to it...

[Darth Vargas]

I may be coming too late on this discussion but as far as I understand and have read about it, in movie world the reason for the lack of thingies in the helmet comes in part because Vader didn´t need so many things in his helmet at the time of episode 3.

his neck vertebrae where fine at the time and he shouldn't have had a need for a neck bracer. this part should have started as a neck seal more than anything else at the time.

his armor was very uncomfortable and it hurt vader quite a bit which made the feat of sleeping practically impossible for him.

being the technical wonder he was it is very sound that he couldn´t stop modding his suit whenever he had the chance as well as his lightsaber and thus the chances between one movie to another.

now... during the period between ep 4 and 5 there´s an adventure called Splinter of the mind´s eye in which Vader falls a very deep shaft and in the fall he breaks the 3rd vertebrae, rendering him quadraplegic and without the ability of breathing by himself.

the fact that his lungs where already very scarred and thus in need of an automatic respirator was the one thing that saved his life in that fall.

it is safe to assume that after that event Vader had to have his neck seal modified to integrate the part into his neck including a cybernetic 3rd vertebrae that you can clearly see iluminated in the final confrontantion with the emperor and its this specific part that the emperor aims the lighning shots towards.

look at the scene carefully... Palpatine shoots Three very powerful electric Arcs to vader´s Neck seal and at the Third, just before Vader throws him down the shaft his neck explodes in a shower of sparks and he falls to over the rails, unnable to move again.

with his circuits fried his respirator no longer functions and hes able to survive a few minutes with his damaged lungs.

Darth Vader dies in, the end, of Asphyxia more than anything else.

this explains, at least to me, why the lack of detail in episode 3 and why it became more and more complicated as the years whent by.


in the real world... well.... we have the answer from the guy himself LOL!